You are not starving or being gassed by a death panel yet, by your previous claims you should be.
that is because I have money and not yet had to have the government determine if I "need" medical care yet.
Far better to let corporate lackeys who have a vested interest in denying care to you and your family make your need-for-treatment decisions.
I'll rather trust the corporate lackeys over redtape government lackeys, since they can be sued.... Government protects itself too well.
You ever try suing a company after you are dead?
or the government while you're alive....
In the actual, real world, you know, the one we live in, we need both. We need a private health care industry and we need the people's elected representatives to regulate that industry.
It is part of the checks and balances that this nation was built on. It is foolish to let a for-profit corporation set our nation's goals and standards for us, they will set them so that they make the most money. As painful as it is for some to accept, our nation's goals must be set by those we voters elect for that purpose.
Of the people, by the people, for the people, that is the general idea, anyway.
and look at the mess the feds have put medical industry into with medicaid, medicare, and all the other programs that don't paid their fair price that have caused medical costs to skyrocket and will bankrupted our economy with the socialist infection that is out to ruin our country.
Hey, you are entitled to your opinion about Medicaid and Medicare, but I don't think the facts support your point of view.
Without these programs, a lot of people would just have to do without health care, and without the funding for medical goods and services, the health care industry would be a fraction of what it is, to say nothing of the innovation that has taken place since Medicare began in 1965, innovation that has taken place in the Capitalist tradition of getting a piece of that government funding.
If you would rather live in a much poorer country where medicine is decades behind where we stand today and people are dying left and right for lack of medical care, go ahead, we'll pack you a sammich.
What we have is not anywhere near to a perfect system but it is a better system than we had prior to Medicare. There are plenty of countries where they do things without the socialism of programs like Medicaid and Medicare. Most of the Latin American countries are pay as you go or you get no medical attention. Go check any one of them out and get back to us about the evils of socialism.
It did funnel lots of money into the industry paying below the proper mark up (even insurance gets a reduced cost for bulk customers), so pushing the lost on paying customers can only last so long before something breaks.... The difference is that we are more free to do what we want in this society compared to the others, not that the government is attempting to grab all reigns of power for their own gratification....
Yes, it funneled lots of money into the medical industry, and the result is Capitalism at its best; products and services now exist beyond the comprehension of pre-Medicare caregivers, an explosion of innovation beyond anything in previous human history for the relief of pain and the treatment of illness and injury.
I really don't see how pinning a label of Socialism (inappropriately imho) on this program outweighs the tremendous benefits it has spawned.
But this is the danger of putting political ideology above every other consideration, you run the risk of de-funding the goose that lays the golden egg because golden egg-laying geese are contrary to your politics.
and the Constitution: don't see that spot where the government is required to spend money for everyone's medical bills.... or even allowed to do so.
Thats part of providing for the common defense.
that is a bit of stretch allowing socialist programs run amok...
I guess you have forgotten about the terrorist attacks using anthrax as well as the exstance of numerous bioweapon programs around the world. Could one of them have given you dementia? Better get an MRI done before it's too late!
Nope, just a sane person in an insanity country that tried to gain power even when the founding documents does not give the federal government certain rights, plus that the states and people are more important in the overall scheme of things. Only a federalist or socialist gains anything from making up shit to gain more power and it ain't for the people's benefit...
We need a private health care industry "
actually, we don't. most first world countries with the best health care do not have a private health care industry (france, uk). you are just saying that to seem impartial for the sake of it. it's called argumentum ad temperantiam and you fall into it in nearly every thread on this site.
Huh? So the founding fathers wanted us to be defenseless? Remember, when the big one hits, be it nuclear, chemical or biological, the only thing standing between you and death are healthcare personelle, and they don't work for free.
How about providing for the general welfare? That is part of what the Constitution is supposed to accomplish.
Thomas Jefferson explained the latter general welfare clause for the United States: 1C[T]he laying of taxes is the power, and the general welfare the purpose for which the power is to be exercised. They [Congress] are not to lay taxes ad libitum for any purpose they please; but only to pay the debts or provide for the welfare of the Union. In like manner, they are not to do anything they please to provide for the general welfare, but only to lay taxes for that purpose. 1D[7]
Actually we do, since the federal government does not have the right or the power to create an industry. Good luck in proving the Constitution gives them that power.
A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. That gives us the right to overthrow the feds when they overstep their bounds too far. Death panels are proper nickname for panels that can deny health care, since it could end up killing you from lack of treatment. Their budget and red tape is more important than your life.
If that is how you define Death Panel then every private insurance company is a Death Panel.
What else would you call it when they deny coverage, or drop someone for being sick?
(And just to keep the record straight, the so called Death Panels in the reform are available to advise a patient by request and their advice is confidential and not binding. Other than that, they are really scary. 
)
for now, just wait until they beef up the power of the government side of the "reform".
See what you did there? You claimed something that wasn't true and when confronted with it, rather than admitting you have been suckered by propaganda, you insist that it will become true at some later time.
Those kinds of advisory groups exist right now, but they vary from hospital to hospital and from one part of the country to the other. The thing that the liars call 'Death Panels' is just an effort to standardize what is done and what is offered now on a hit and miss basis.
The idea that these groups would be putting people to death is an outright lie, and a deliberate one at that.
Don't mean they sure have done so.
it's constitutional. you just don't understand what you're talking about.
Food stamp use hit record 40.8m in May ... that's real recovery for you. From today's news .. oh that's right .. this is all GW's fault.
US to train foreign IT workers this will help the recovery .. I'm sure.
108 Banks closed so far in 2010 .. more green shoots
we're in the midst of a massive deleveraging process that is going to take closer to 10 years than 2. if you don't see that, you're a monkey. we need far more stimulus money than the pittance being passed in congress to make any meaningful impact on employment. we need large scale mobilization of the government to create real industrial jobs right now. krugman and other leading economists have been saying this for over 2 years. if you scale back infrastructure investment ("stimulus"), then you end up with more negative growth and a completely shattered country. morons wanting to cease all spending will take us back to the 17th century. this is a very serious issue. it takes more than 100 IQ points to fully appreciate and contemplate a real solution to the problem. the political hacks on this thread make me sick because it's all a game to you.
They aren't stupid, they are simply following a game plan. The GOP has figured out that their ticket to regaining political control in the Congress is the unemployment rate. The higher the rate on election day, the more new Republicans seats in Congress. So they are criticizing any and all current spending that might lower the unemployment rate. In effect they are trying to get as many people out of work as possible.
The idea that putting people back to work is a job for the GOP is deeply ironic given their long push for outsourcing and for letting illegals compete for American jobs and wages. But in the current political climate, high unemployment means success for conservatives. That is why they opposed the Bill that keep tens of thousands of teachers from being let go last week, they wanted those teachers out of work, as many as possible to help their chances in November.
They aren't stupid, they just want power anyway they can get it, so they can stop 'wasteful spending' on anything that isn't corporate welfare. Anything the benefits people who work for a living is a waste of money to them.
thebaron
it did not save very much and only caused the market with a fake recovery that will continue economy problems further than if those places were allowed to fail and allow the market to pick up the pieces thus making them stronger but removing the weak from the market.